Following up from my musings about the Empire, my thoughts have been distracted by all the flowering trees in the Hutt. This naturally brings out the Woodie in me (tree hugger that I am-blame my father and having a garden with "potential"). So I thought I would share my current beliefs on how I think I want a woodie list to look like.
First off a history:
I've had mixed success with the woodies in 8th. Vs some armies I have kicked some butt, vs others I have fallen apart. Success has ridden on how quickly the Treeman dies (or not) and if my Treekin are gatewayed/flamed to death. Shooting has played a biggish part, but mainly I have stuck to a rather boring formula of:
lvl4, bsb, bwraith with cluster, 20 GG, 10 GG, 2x 10 Dryads, 6 treekin, 2 eagles, Treeman and then spare points on more trees.
Works wonders, but is really let down by the fact that it does alright in most areas, but excels at none. Compare that to my Empire (excels bait and trap based combat with plenty of scary and owns both magic phases) and my High Elves (excels at straight up fisty cuffs and dangerous in the magic phase).
So what do woodies excel at? Shooting and avoidance. s4 move and shoot is awesome. small units that pack a punch is awesome. I have not been utilising these 2 aspects of the woodies. Instead I have been relying on the t5/s5 to win the day...and at 390 points a units that's a lot of hope (especially when for LESS points my 18 swordmasters will walk over 6 treekin without blinking).
So I have decided to focus on emphasising the shooting and the avoidance to create Elven based woodie lists.
Oh-and my 46 Eternal Guard are still yet to get removed from their box-as beautiful as they are. Here's hoping the drop in cost and/or get awesome (at least to 7th levels of awesomeness when they were deceptively amazing).
Below are 3 lists that I have worked on in succession to help demonstrate my thought process:
First list:
lvl4: scroll life 275
BSB: LA, Abane, HODA 132
20 GGuard: m, sb-flame 268
4x10 GGuard: m 504
2x10 GGuard: m, sb 276
5 wardancers 90
5 wardancers 90
4 Tkin 260
5 Waywatchers 120
2 Eagles 100
Treeman 285
2399
So this list is like "ZOMG SHOOTING" Will waltz over any army that has no calv/isnt skaven. However, 285 points are just asking to be pitted/stone throwered/gatwayed etc. It's good, but excessive and falls apart vs certain things.
Second list:
lvl4: scroll, life 275
BSB: Abane, HODA: 130
20 GG: m, sb-flame 268
4x10 GGuard: m 504
2x10 GGuard: m, sb 276
5 wardancers 90
5 wardancers 90
6 Tkin 390
6 wildriders: (m) 156
5 Waywatchers 120
2 Eagles 100
2399
SO similar theme to first list except the pit target has disappeared and in its place is a combat effective unit of treekin and some wildriders. Wildriders are a bit controversial in anyone's language in 8th because they have lost their main 7th role...sit back, chose target and pounce. I ague that they can still do this-they just have to be a bit savvy about it-and vanguard really helps here. Deploy 3 wide to reduce return attacks. Hit target, win combat and reform to wide formation to maximise special rule. Also gives a unit to charge forward at chariots etc. HOWEVER, the list is still vulnerable to storm banner and will get crowded out and block its own line of sight...shooting is excessive.
Third and latest draft:
lvl4: scroll, life 275
A.Highborn: La, 2hw, Dhelm, BoLoren, a.bodkins, SoRB 289
BSB: LA, Abane, HODA 132
19 GG: m, sb-flame 256
2x10 GGuard: M 252
2x10 GGuard: m, sb 276
5 wardancers 90
5 wardancers 90
6 Tkin 390
5 wildriders: (m) 130
5 Waywatchers 120
2 Eagles 100
2400
So dropping 21 archers, 1 wildrider to gain the machine gun alter with uber defensive kit and 6 s4 attacks. This guy has it all. Deals with the things woodies struggle with (armoured knights, stanks) and adds a nasty combat charge. 6 s4 attacks alongside the wildriders and the target unit is losing that combat! List is now almost competitive vs Skaven too. Less shooting to be affected by Storm Banner and more small combat units to get multicharges going + enough fast units to get to the greyseer quickly. Still very vulnerable to the 13th...but what isnt really? (Tune in next week for my Horde of Inner Circle Knights list). If I was tabled by anything other than panzer division Skaven I would feel like I had played a crap game/really bad luck.
But vs other armies?
OnG-can deal with chariots, manglers, doomdiver and blocks of troops are just blocks of troops
WoC-Hell cannon will be an issue, but enough s4 shooting and KB to dent the warriors for clean up.
Delves-Dark what? List is effectively shadow magic proof and will out shoot anything that gets sent near it.
Empire- Stank can be wounded now (ignore armour woot!). lightly armoured troops die just as easily as the always have to bowfire and no real artillery targets except the alter (so get to combat fast or get smart about positioning for shooting at stank)
Helves: same as the Delves. More likely to see a dragon-but KB galore and bowfire will win the day.
DoC-hmmmm lots of t3 will suffer. Alter and Wildriders might find the siren annoying, and Greater Demons will require concentrated bow fire-but not impossible to fell one.
Brets- KNIGHTS ARE ANNOYING. Shoot lots to get past the armour! Treekin and wardancers will be king here.
Lizards- well hmmmmm shoot out the skirmishers, kill the steg and hope the Slann doesnt finish you off!
Tkings- yet to play them, but plenty of shooting to get the chariots and warsphinxs
Ogres-the new kids on the block...approach with caution...hopefully can kill enough with shooting before crying
Beastmen- well...list is very shadow proof, so that's them sorted.
So hopefully my reasoning is sound and the list is effective. If I cant get my Helves painted up for the next event (looking unlikely due to all the effort etc being put in), will very much consider rocking a list like this to see how it rolls.
Tuesday, 11 October 2011
Friday, 7 October 2011
Rethinking the Empire post Home Con
Alrighty, so Home Con has been and gone. I've spent the last few weeks kinda avoiding the hobby. Not on purpose of course...more just taking a mental break to refresh.
I had 2 games 2 weekends ago with my Helves and Empire vs WoC. These games were very much dominated by the WoC lvl4 IFing turn 1 both games (game 1- sucked into warp, game 2-became a lvl1). The Empire game was a lot closer than the High Elf game when my horde Whitelions wiped out the 2hw Korn Warriors in 1 round (the Kwar charged me), then took out the Tznch warriors the next. Whitelions are nasty and should be avoided at all costs. At this rate my 2 boxes of Phoenix Guard are going to be spending alot longer on the sprue waiting for an armybook upgrade to justify their inclusion in an army. Swordmasters are still awesome-even if just from the threat factor. Lore of shadow and High Magic on the lvl2 is an awesome combo. The threat of drain magic means I can get the hexes off easier as dice are held back. My Star Trek fanboi credentials were tarnished though when wraith of Khaine only killed 1 doggie all game...
The Empire game was rather interesting. One of my Halberd blocks took a pounding early on, so reformed to bus only to get the discman in the rear. Careful use of lore of light and challenges meant that unit survived (holding lvl4, BSB and wpriest!). But damn can a WoC hero with the breath weapon rip through units! The other unit was lost to the Tzch warriors in a prolonged grind, but I cleaned up everything else for a comfortable win.
Last weekend was the Auckland tournament with the weird comp that I did not attend. I got a game or 2 tomorrow where I test my "revised" Empire list that rifts off the lessons learned and observed at Home Con + with the Ogres now a "real" consideration.
The list I'll be trialing:
Alector:Walter, GW, AOMI, VHS 286
lvl4: shadow, seal of destruction, ruby ring, dragon bane gem 285
BSB: FPA, Opal Amulet, ch.shield, ICI, 108
W.Priest: HA, fencers "hammers" 129
Captasus: FPA, sh, Dhel, SoMight, Dstone 160
38 Halberds: FC 210
38 Halberds: FC 210
2x5 FCompany Detach 50
30 Flagellants 300
10 xbows 80
2x5 5 archers detach 80
2 Cannons 200
Stank 300
2398
So some choices are aesthetic (dual hammers W.Priest is the most bad ass model ever...other than Fabio Valten), others are obvious (2 cannons).
I've opted to gross myself out and take stanky walter for a number of reasons that were mainly motivated by dropping the 2nd unit of Flagellants.
I found that 600 points in very squishy models can be awesome!, but if someone has the ability to stay out of combat and just simply shoot them = massive points liability. This happened vs Pete's Skaven, and Jack's Empire, and I forsee it vs any Lizardman/Delf/woodie list I come across.
Bringing in the Walter gives me loremaster 6 dice monkey of cool-freeing up my lvl4 for shadow. The last wee while I've stopped using the area of affect lore of light spells (other than pha's turn 1/2). This is due to me becoming more selective in my combat decisions, and from using shadow with High elves (ie forcing me to focus on 1 combat at a time). Shadow gives me the tools to deal with the things my Empire really struggle with (ARMOUR)...with mindrazor and also Pit for the big scaries (Im looking at you Ogres!).
It also ties up points in a hard to get place.
To counter the "focus on 1 thing at a time" I've added more chaff....skirmishing chaff. this means I should always catch the manglers + a little bit more token shooting (woot!) that is not to be underestimated; my archer detachments in 7th were fantastic at killing Greater Demons...
Also early game I have 2 magic missiles/turn to throw at opponents + pit if I have it. This + the shooting = clearing out the chaff and keeping the pressure up.
WHY NO ROCKET BATTERY????????????
For the same reason I dropped the mortar. I dont want to spend points on an Engineer to baby sit it + it's more free points for stuff that gets past my lines/comes on from behind. With 2 cannons, magic missles and shadow = dont really need "another" template. It also stops me feeling bad having Stanky walter...Jack was very correct when stating that walter, stank, engineered Rocketbattery, 2 cannons is a very, very strong empire build starting point! I like to sit just behind the "max" build out of principle.
Anyway, looking forward to gaming tomorrow and also vs Pete....if you're reading this...NO TAILORING!
I had 2 games 2 weekends ago with my Helves and Empire vs WoC. These games were very much dominated by the WoC lvl4 IFing turn 1 both games (game 1- sucked into warp, game 2-became a lvl1). The Empire game was a lot closer than the High Elf game when my horde Whitelions wiped out the 2hw Korn Warriors in 1 round (the Kwar charged me), then took out the Tznch warriors the next. Whitelions are nasty and should be avoided at all costs. At this rate my 2 boxes of Phoenix Guard are going to be spending alot longer on the sprue waiting for an armybook upgrade to justify their inclusion in an army. Swordmasters are still awesome-even if just from the threat factor. Lore of shadow and High Magic on the lvl2 is an awesome combo. The threat of drain magic means I can get the hexes off easier as dice are held back. My Star Trek fanboi credentials were tarnished though when wraith of Khaine only killed 1 doggie all game...
The Empire game was rather interesting. One of my Halberd blocks took a pounding early on, so reformed to bus only to get the discman in the rear. Careful use of lore of light and challenges meant that unit survived (holding lvl4, BSB and wpriest!). But damn can a WoC hero with the breath weapon rip through units! The other unit was lost to the Tzch warriors in a prolonged grind, but I cleaned up everything else for a comfortable win.
Last weekend was the Auckland tournament with the weird comp that I did not attend. I got a game or 2 tomorrow where I test my "revised" Empire list that rifts off the lessons learned and observed at Home Con + with the Ogres now a "real" consideration.
The list I'll be trialing:
Alector:Walter, GW, AOMI, VHS 286
lvl4: shadow, seal of destruction, ruby ring, dragon bane gem 285
BSB: FPA, Opal Amulet, ch.shield, ICI, 108
W.Priest: HA, fencers "hammers" 129
Captasus: FPA, sh, Dhel, SoMight, Dstone 160
38 Halberds: FC 210
38 Halberds: FC 210
2x5 FCompany Detach 50
30 Flagellants 300
10 xbows 80
2x5 5 archers detach 80
2 Cannons 200
Stank 300
2398
So some choices are aesthetic (dual hammers W.Priest is the most bad ass model ever...other than Fabio Valten), others are obvious (2 cannons).
I've opted to gross myself out and take stanky walter for a number of reasons that were mainly motivated by dropping the 2nd unit of Flagellants.
I found that 600 points in very squishy models can be awesome!, but if someone has the ability to stay out of combat and just simply shoot them = massive points liability. This happened vs Pete's Skaven, and Jack's Empire, and I forsee it vs any Lizardman/Delf/woodie list I come across.
Bringing in the Walter gives me loremaster 6 dice monkey of cool-freeing up my lvl4 for shadow. The last wee while I've stopped using the area of affect lore of light spells (other than pha's turn 1/2). This is due to me becoming more selective in my combat decisions, and from using shadow with High elves (ie forcing me to focus on 1 combat at a time). Shadow gives me the tools to deal with the things my Empire really struggle with (ARMOUR)...with mindrazor and also Pit for the big scaries (Im looking at you Ogres!).
It also ties up points in a hard to get place.
To counter the "focus on 1 thing at a time" I've added more chaff....skirmishing chaff. this means I should always catch the manglers + a little bit more token shooting (woot!) that is not to be underestimated; my archer detachments in 7th were fantastic at killing Greater Demons...
Also early game I have 2 magic missiles/turn to throw at opponents + pit if I have it. This + the shooting = clearing out the chaff and keeping the pressure up.
WHY NO ROCKET BATTERY????????????
For the same reason I dropped the mortar. I dont want to spend points on an Engineer to baby sit it + it's more free points for stuff that gets past my lines/comes on from behind. With 2 cannons, magic missles and shadow = dont really need "another" template. It also stops me feeling bad having Stanky walter...Jack was very correct when stating that walter, stank, engineered Rocketbattery, 2 cannons is a very, very strong empire build starting point! I like to sit just behind the "max" build out of principle.
Anyway, looking forward to gaming tomorrow and also vs Pete....if you're reading this...NO TAILORING!
Sunday, 11 September 2011
Home-Con 2011 quick battle reports
Ok, so just attended Home-Con hosted by Pete Dunn. The event was a standard 10 man tournament with Pete-lite comp. I took the following list:
A.lector: Ha, sh (general)
Lvl4: Light, Rod of Power
W.Priest: Ha, 2hw
BSB: FPA, Charmed Shield, Opal Amulet, Wrymslayer Sword
Captain: Pegasus, FPA, sh, Sword of Fate, Dragon helm
2x38 Halberds: FC with 5 Free Company Detachment
10 xbows
2x30 Flagellants
2 Cannons
Stank
Other lists can be found here: http://www.thefieldsofblood.com/2011/09/homecon-lists.html
My thinking going in was “yay 4 WoC lists that love to get into combat with my combat army.”
So anyway the games:
Game 1: vs Tom Dunn DoC. Battleline 15-5 to me
Game one got off to a great start when I was half an hour late due to my car having a hissy fit at the supermarket. I was a little concerned with the GUO, but the rest of his list wasn’t too much of an issue as I was confident I had the numbers to deal with it....underneath that 5+ ward is a t3 guy who is wounded just as easily as any other t3 guy. The game really swung my way turn 1 when the GUO sucked himself into the warp in exchange for 1 flagellant. Good trade if you ask me. Other highlights included flags with timewarp rolling snake eyes for support charge...then basically getting shot to bits. My Sword of Fate sat at the back guarding my cannons. I managed to get his fiends, 1 unit of Bletters, 1 unit of furies and the GUO of course.
Game 2: vs Jack Dunn Empire. Random Deployment. 6-14 to Jack.
So the mirror match. The game started badly with turn 1 the stank getting pitted, then in my turn the lvl4 decided to join the GUO in the warp. This was my death blow...540 points down is a bit of an ask. I managed to destroy the alter turn 1, and got the A.lector turn 5 when my flagellants ripped his Halberds a new one. This flagellants ripped my other unit a new one. Shadow miasma was really good here when have identical stats! I think I fought back well from the initial loss, but a few things like only 1 wound on the stank from cannon etc meant things didn’t really work out for me. But a really fun game.
Game 3: vs Tim Norling’s WoC. Battle for the Pass. I won by 220 points so I assume 11-9
THE UBER MAURUDER HORDES! I have been looking forward to playing against this army for a long time. Basically Cannons with clear field of fire FTW. This game was a bit of a tactical thinker. Tim made a crucial mistake when he forgot you cannot pursue off the edge of the table. This enabled me to get flagellants into the front and halberds into the flank of one of the hordes. The other horde got a stank to the front and slowing ground down. I then charged one of the Free Company units into the flank (to get it out of the way to allow the other halberd flank charge). I won the combat by lots, the horde failed its re-roll ldship 9 test, to get run down by an angry redhead lass. In other news, I lost a halberd unit to a tzch warrior unit with HW/SH + BSB and combat lvl4, but I got the other unit in a grind with the other halberd unit. Best part of the game was getting a 12 dice dispel phase...yeah.
Game 4: vs Pete Dunn. Blood and Glory lose by 335 points So I assume 12-8 or 13-7
Having faced the sons, I finally face the father. Last time we met on the table my army fell apart sceptically. I played this game really carefully. I got his Abomb with my flagellants-losing 1 unit in the process. My cannons got his plague furnace, but the priest passed his opal amulet ward when the first ball of iron picked him off. I then spent the rest of the game trying to get them to fail a frenzy test and run into my trap...sadly they kept passing their restrain tests...no matter how many ranks I stripped off them. My “golden ticket” failed to pay off. The Warp lightening cannon exploded, I banished the catapult, and the points swing was losing my 2nd unit of flagellants on the last turn....I can dispel magic, cant dispel gutter runners! Lamest part was my Pegasus guy charging the engineer worth points in a building and failing to do anything! This is after failing 2 of 3 poison s3 wounds when attacking gutter runners in combat. Captasus was worst performing part of my army. A very thinking close game which could have gone either way...I’ll get you yet Pete!
Game 5 vs Sam Whitt’s WoC. Diagonal Deployment Draw 10-10
This game was a draw for 2 reasons: my super Tory deployment, and me rolling all the crap lore of light spells with no doubles. To be fair, my stank, lvl4, A.lector and W.Priest all started in reserve. Basically vs WoC to go toe to toe (esp with 2 units of knights) I need the buffs. Only combats were my xbows vs Marauder horsemen (I won that one), knights on Flagellants (Had 1 left at end of game woot!). The other flag unit took out the other fast calv, and then got stuck on a building. I screwed up their deployment. They should have been 7 wide to squeeze though and support my halberds getting pulverised by knights. Good thing I regularly play Sam, so plenty of chance for less boring a re-match. SORRY SAM FOR CASTLING.
Game 6 vs Neil Williamson’s Brets. Battleline. Win 14-6
This game was rather fun. I took bets from all in the room as to what turn my stank would be Heroically killing blow’ed. They all said turn 3...it was turn 4. I managed to delay this by parking my stank behind a marsh. It was only when the one time all tournament I went for 5 steam points and rolled a 6 that he got his knights around and into the stank (I went into panic mode and re-arranged my line to absorb the charge with the stank as "bait"). Having a lvl4 vs 2 lvl1’s really swung the game my way. Casually giving flagellants Timewarp and my halberds ws and I 10 meant I could grind against his 2+as casually. I was lucky to take out the general’s unit. After HKBing the stank, he needed a 9 on the overrun to get into my halberds. He rolled a 7, giving me a casual flank charge. Timewarp later and his general’s unit was rolled on the charge. My Captasus was once again a massive fail at killing. It managed to hold up the peg knights all game, but didn’t do any wounds. Neil played well, just getting a little unlucky with the general and not having the ability to control my magic.
RESULT.
In the end I drew for 4th place with Tom’s DoC. 3 wins, 2 loses and a draw was a good result given that of the two loses, 1 could have swung in my favour by the same amount, and the other was a turn 1 fail. No one managed to win all 6 games, and no one lost all 6 games; so a really fun, close tournament. Hopefully there will be another event soon.
My army:
I was happy with my list. The only change I would make is to drop the Sword of Fate, replacing it with the sword of might. The captain just wasn’t killy enough, and I found that I had killed the target with cannons before he could get into combat, or the target was so good that it would be fluky for me to get the kill. Sword of might makes him more “all round useful”. The spare points could give him a ward of some sort, or more xbows (who were on FIRE all weekend).
Still though, hopefully I can get the High Elves looking good before the next event as I’m keen to get them blooded.
Monday, 5 September 2011
Home-Con lists
So I promise battle reports!
The lists for Home-Con can be found here: http://www.thefieldsofblood.com/2011/09/homecon-lists.html
Basically it's a Chaos fest.
Biggest army of concern: the Demons-Hopefully I have the anti magic to control the GUO. Not too sure how I'm going to kill it-cannons + Sword of Fate I suspect. Hordes of Blood letters are not too much of an issue as I have hordes of cod pieces and fluffy hats, so basically I win on that front. Also lore of light ftw here... Games history vs Tom has been a horrible loss with Ogres vs DoC in a watch tower mission (woot!) and a very, very ,very boring draw with woodies on woodies.
Next army of concern is Neil's Brets. I've only ever played against Brets on 2 occasions in 7th with my woodies. Both times I was beaten soundly. vs Neil my history has been a tabling by super goblins in 7th and a solid victory to me vs a more "balanced" 7th OnG list. He's been a solid team mate the last two campaigns, so will be an interesting match up. I'm basically going to be relying on my superior magic to shut down his magic and get some light buffs up to stop his charges meaning anything. Also very scary that Virtue of Heroic Killing Blow auto hitting my lovely stank :( Plan there will be to throw the Stank forward into something and pray to Sigmar that it kills something before it gets splatted. Sword of Fate will be no use as in a unit and will just challenge me away (as he has to do). I'll think of something like diverting him away.
Army to watch will be Peter's High Elves (for tips and tricks for my own selfish reasons). This list is basically his 7th ed high elf list that kept beating everything that got thrown at it. Hopefully the 8th effect will be in my favour. I see the speed of his being a bit of an issue, but cannons to the FACE of the dragon and I should be ok...Also only lvl1 on the prince = I should have magic dominance. I suspect each magic phase will be "I cast shield of sapphery, and then I cast drain magic". Unit to note: them pesky White lions-they have a history of treeman killing...vs Peter my games history has been a slight win with woodies vs Dwarfs, and then 2 losses vs his high elves with woodies. Also a frustrating loss in the first campaign with fun empire (ie had knights and swordsmen unit) vs his Goblins. Basically my army blew itself up and everything went wrong so wasnt really a game.
And then the Warrior armies woot. Flagellants love warriors and ironically I want to be in CC with them to get my grind on.
So looking forward to it. Just gotta finish my 2nd unit of flagellants....
The lists for Home-Con can be found here: http://www.thefieldsofblood.com/2011/09/homecon-lists.html
Basically it's a Chaos fest.
Biggest army of concern: the Demons-Hopefully I have the anti magic to control the GUO. Not too sure how I'm going to kill it-cannons + Sword of Fate I suspect. Hordes of Blood letters are not too much of an issue as I have hordes of cod pieces and fluffy hats, so basically I win on that front. Also lore of light ftw here... Games history vs Tom has been a horrible loss with Ogres vs DoC in a watch tower mission (woot!) and a very, very ,very boring draw with woodies on woodies.
Next army of concern is Neil's Brets. I've only ever played against Brets on 2 occasions in 7th with my woodies. Both times I was beaten soundly. vs Neil my history has been a tabling by super goblins in 7th and a solid victory to me vs a more "balanced" 7th OnG list. He's been a solid team mate the last two campaigns, so will be an interesting match up. I'm basically going to be relying on my superior magic to shut down his magic and get some light buffs up to stop his charges meaning anything. Also very scary that Virtue of Heroic Killing Blow auto hitting my lovely stank :( Plan there will be to throw the Stank forward into something and pray to Sigmar that it kills something before it gets splatted. Sword of Fate will be no use as in a unit and will just challenge me away (as he has to do). I'll think of something like diverting him away.
Army to watch will be Peter's High Elves (for tips and tricks for my own selfish reasons). This list is basically his 7th ed high elf list that kept beating everything that got thrown at it. Hopefully the 8th effect will be in my favour. I see the speed of his being a bit of an issue, but cannons to the FACE of the dragon and I should be ok...Also only lvl1 on the prince = I should have magic dominance. I suspect each magic phase will be "I cast shield of sapphery, and then I cast drain magic". Unit to note: them pesky White lions-they have a history of treeman killing...vs Peter my games history has been a slight win with woodies vs Dwarfs, and then 2 losses vs his high elves with woodies. Also a frustrating loss in the first campaign with fun empire (ie had knights and swordsmen unit) vs his Goblins. Basically my army blew itself up and everything went wrong so wasnt really a game.
And then the Warrior armies woot. Flagellants love warriors and ironically I want to be in CC with them to get my grind on.
So looking forward to it. Just gotta finish my 2nd unit of flagellants....
Thursday, 25 August 2011
Home Con 2011
Home-Con is approaching soon. 2400 points, Petelite comp, 6 games, all battleline (I assume for speed and ease of play).
After much thought and "you know, a last minute modelling project is just what you need" niggle to itch I've decided to take the following:
Alector: HA, sh (General) 134
Alector: HA, 2hw 137
lvl4: light, scroll 235
BSB: FPA, charmed sh, opal Amulet 103
46 Halberds: Fc 250
5 free company Detach 25
30 Flagellants 300
10 xbows 80
40 Halberds: M, Sb 212
5 Free company Detach 25
2 cannons 200
5 Pistoliers: M 97
30 Flagellants 300 (the modelling project)
Stank 300 (Have old metal one to use, but want to convert up a holy mobile for future "fluff")
2398
My first thoughts after writing this were "crap-no pie templates" and "+4 Dispel dice and scroll...nasty I like"
Why no Pie templates?
Artillery = easy points for opponent to take. Scorpions, gutter runners, miners, shades etc love artillery. + my artillery loves to explode inconveniently. My list works around preserving points and dishing the pain...in Close combat. The artillery I have is to kill the things my other stuff struggles to kill + cannon to front of t4 unit will kill more than a direct mortar hit.
Why all the anti Magic?
Because I can. And it was not the "intention." The intention was to give my halberds hatred and not spend points on defensive equipment. W.priests are great, but adding an extra wound adds survivability. + now ld9 for tests woot!
Why 2 units of Flaggellants?
Because 2 is better than 1. One unit can be diverted/dwellered/artilleried etc. 2 + the stank = 3 mega annoying things to deal with, so something is going to get through-even if it is the halberds.
This list looks like a "what is good in the book"...where's the fluff bunny?
Fluff bunny is meet through a number of things. 2 Alectors = 2 units of flagellants. The Stank will be replaced with converted stank to be a priest mobile (suedo Waralter-but not). No artillery wall, no engineers + using lore of light-which suits the religious theme. Also halberds because every province has them. Not really a justification, but it's not the "usual" internet Empire list.
So those who are attending-you have been warned... the Empire is on the march and it has a crazy look in its eye!
After much thought and "you know, a last minute modelling project is just what you need" niggle to itch I've decided to take the following:
Alector: HA, sh (General) 134
Alector: HA, 2hw 137
lvl4: light, scroll 235
BSB: FPA, charmed sh, opal Amulet 103
46 Halberds: Fc 250
5 free company Detach 25
30 Flagellants 300
10 xbows 80
40 Halberds: M, Sb 212
5 Free company Detach 25
2 cannons 200
5 Pistoliers: M 97
30 Flagellants 300 (the modelling project)
Stank 300 (Have old metal one to use, but want to convert up a holy mobile for future "fluff")
2398
My first thoughts after writing this were "crap-no pie templates" and "+4 Dispel dice and scroll...nasty I like"
Why no Pie templates?
Artillery = easy points for opponent to take. Scorpions, gutter runners, miners, shades etc love artillery. + my artillery loves to explode inconveniently. My list works around preserving points and dishing the pain...in Close combat. The artillery I have is to kill the things my other stuff struggles to kill + cannon to front of t4 unit will kill more than a direct mortar hit.
Why all the anti Magic?
Because I can. And it was not the "intention." The intention was to give my halberds hatred and not spend points on defensive equipment. W.priests are great, but adding an extra wound adds survivability. + now ld9 for tests woot!
Why 2 units of Flaggellants?
Because 2 is better than 1. One unit can be diverted/dwellered/artilleried etc. 2 + the stank = 3 mega annoying things to deal with, so something is going to get through-even if it is the halberds.
This list looks like a "what is good in the book"...where's the fluff bunny?
Fluff bunny is meet through a number of things. 2 Alectors = 2 units of flagellants. The Stank will be replaced with converted stank to be a priest mobile (suedo Waralter-but not). No artillery wall, no engineers + using lore of light-which suits the religious theme. Also halberds because every province has them. Not really a justification, but it's not the "usual" internet Empire list.
So those who are attending-you have been warned... the Empire is on the march and it has a crazy look in its eye!
Monday, 15 August 2011
Sorry for the lack of posts-round up and High Elf thoughts
Hi fellow Warhammer nerds (Restpec....Westside..iiiiiiiiiei)
Sorry for the lack of posts. I've just bought a house (move in this weekend-so no Call to Arms for me sadface). I've got a HE vs OnG battlereport to put up when I have time. Basically it is random charge fail 101...in a lolz way.
My high elf army is coming along nicely. Got heaps painted; I'll put pics up when I get a chance. The theme is coming together really well.
I''ve also had some thoughts on the High Elves:
1. Need magic defence: +5 to dispel with lvl4 is really good, so is the scroll. However, the lack of channelling and extra dice really hurts-hence why decided to add a 2nd mage with the steal a power dice crystal to help even the odds (and hopefully keep the swordmasters alove longer!).
2. Lore of Shadow is not all it's made out to be (really, well unless you have the cauldron providing support too grumble grumble): The threat spells are too obvious and the lack of magic missiles really hurts. The Meta of 8th maybe towards big blocks of doom (something I do not buy into), however having a way to zap pesky chaff units etc is really useful. My current thoughts are to have shadow on the lvl1 for the base spell and beasts or light on the lvl4. High magic is also something that crosses my mind-possibly on the lvl1 (upping them to a lvl2). Get the drain magic, and chance for some useful spells (flames of the phoenix, etc). I'm dropping the RBT's (to fit the new stuff), so curse of arrow attraction is a dumb "possibility" but with 26 shots I still see it being useful. Beasts gives me an excuse to buy the new DElf dragon model (very, very tempting-but with a different head-like the spare I have in the HE dragon kit....) and solves toughness issues. However the spells are still specific and easily targeted for dispelling...HMMMM 3 characters in combat...I wonder what spell I'm going to cast...Lore of light has 4 spells that have area affect = hard to dispel the "key" ones-especially if also know drain magic is on its way. ASF spell gives my swordmasters/DP's, WLions some serious chop that will prove very useful. Also the i10/ws10 gives me something to combat black guard with. Also pha's to help control pesky war machines!
3. Shooting is great, but RBT's too expensive and archers not good enough: so basically need the archers to make up core. I've toyed with the idea of sea guard (cool models mainly), however the ability to focus on 2 different units wins out in the end. RBT are a "nice to have" and in the big scheme of things and integral part of the HE army. However, more troops/smarter troops feels like the better choice. Also, if get the curse of arrow attraction spell it is nice to have some "threat units" even if only s3.
4. 2 units of Whitelions seems "optimal": yes/no/maybe? I lose attacks. This is what it comes down to for me. a 2nd unit of whitelions = I have to buy more models (not necessarily a factor, but a consideration), and lose a "lots of attacks" option. Lore of light + swordmasters should = win. The extra magic defence + buffs from lore of light should = they get to combat and HURT.
5. Chariots and E. Reavers: fantastic models. My 2k list sees me using 2 chariots (no calv). However the key here is "two" chariots. The single chariot gets in the way and hasnt achieved what I want it to. It's something I will be dropping. I want to keep the reavers because they are AWESOME vs everything except WoC (unless they bring fast calv of their own. Otherwise they are reduced to anti wolves and an extra 5 shots/turn).
6. SPEED IS KEY: with the Eagles, reavers, DP's, the only thing missing is a support hard hitter = noble on an eagle (with potential double charge range...) possibility to make it a lvl1 for beasts/fire/shadow support too....(evil thoughts). Also means my "griffons" as eagles can have the IoBlood noble all painted up for cool looking awesomeness. (Side note, I REALLY love the IoB models...all of them!). From a tactical perspective The Eagle noble gives me something to take out their support and combo charge with the DP's for a hard hitting flank.
So after all that: my proposed 2400 list:
lvl4: light, scroll 280
BSB: GW, AoCaledor, dawnstone 168
lvl2: high, crystal 175
Noble on Eagle: HA, GW, Dhelm 157
35 Spears: FC 340
13 Archers: M 148
10 Archers: M 115
23 Whitelions: M, SB-Bosorcery 413
5 Dp's: M 160
14 Swordmasters: M, SB -flame 238
5 Reavers 105
2 Eagles 100
So I hope that list supports my thoughts. Next time I get a game with them, this is the list I'll be rocking. If anyone can be bothered commenting on the list, please feel free.
Also got home con coming up in September, so I'll be sharing my thoughts on my Empire list for that (stank stank stank stank...)
Sorry for the lack of posts. I've just bought a house (move in this weekend-so no Call to Arms for me sadface). I've got a HE vs OnG battlereport to put up when I have time. Basically it is random charge fail 101...in a lolz way.
My high elf army is coming along nicely. Got heaps painted; I'll put pics up when I get a chance. The theme is coming together really well.
I''ve also had some thoughts on the High Elves:
1. Need magic defence: +5 to dispel with lvl4 is really good, so is the scroll. However, the lack of channelling and extra dice really hurts-hence why decided to add a 2nd mage with the steal a power dice crystal to help even the odds (and hopefully keep the swordmasters alove longer!).
2. Lore of Shadow is not all it's made out to be (really, well unless you have the cauldron providing support too grumble grumble): The threat spells are too obvious and the lack of magic missiles really hurts. The Meta of 8th maybe towards big blocks of doom (something I do not buy into), however having a way to zap pesky chaff units etc is really useful. My current thoughts are to have shadow on the lvl1 for the base spell and beasts or light on the lvl4. High magic is also something that crosses my mind-possibly on the lvl1 (upping them to a lvl2). Get the drain magic, and chance for some useful spells (flames of the phoenix, etc). I'm dropping the RBT's (to fit the new stuff), so curse of arrow attraction is a dumb "possibility" but with 26 shots I still see it being useful. Beasts gives me an excuse to buy the new DElf dragon model (very, very tempting-but with a different head-like the spare I have in the HE dragon kit....) and solves toughness issues. However the spells are still specific and easily targeted for dispelling...HMMMM 3 characters in combat...I wonder what spell I'm going to cast...Lore of light has 4 spells that have area affect = hard to dispel the "key" ones-especially if also know drain magic is on its way. ASF spell gives my swordmasters/DP's, WLions some serious chop that will prove very useful. Also the i10/ws10 gives me something to combat black guard with. Also pha's to help control pesky war machines!
3. Shooting is great, but RBT's too expensive and archers not good enough: so basically need the archers to make up core. I've toyed with the idea of sea guard (cool models mainly), however the ability to focus on 2 different units wins out in the end. RBT are a "nice to have" and in the big scheme of things and integral part of the HE army. However, more troops/smarter troops feels like the better choice. Also, if get the curse of arrow attraction spell it is nice to have some "threat units" even if only s3.
4. 2 units of Whitelions seems "optimal": yes/no/maybe? I lose attacks. This is what it comes down to for me. a 2nd unit of whitelions = I have to buy more models (not necessarily a factor, but a consideration), and lose a "lots of attacks" option. Lore of light + swordmasters should = win. The extra magic defence + buffs from lore of light should = they get to combat and HURT.
5. Chariots and E. Reavers: fantastic models. My 2k list sees me using 2 chariots (no calv). However the key here is "two" chariots. The single chariot gets in the way and hasnt achieved what I want it to. It's something I will be dropping. I want to keep the reavers because they are AWESOME vs everything except WoC (unless they bring fast calv of their own. Otherwise they are reduced to anti wolves and an extra 5 shots/turn).
6. SPEED IS KEY: with the Eagles, reavers, DP's, the only thing missing is a support hard hitter = noble on an eagle (with potential double charge range...) possibility to make it a lvl1 for beasts/fire/shadow support too....(evil thoughts). Also means my "griffons" as eagles can have the IoBlood noble all painted up for cool looking awesomeness. (Side note, I REALLY love the IoB models...all of them!). From a tactical perspective The Eagle noble gives me something to take out their support and combo charge with the DP's for a hard hitting flank.
So after all that: my proposed 2400 list:
lvl4: light, scroll 280
BSB: GW, AoCaledor, dawnstone 168
lvl2: high, crystal 175
Noble on Eagle: HA, GW, Dhelm 157
35 Spears: FC 340
13 Archers: M 148
10 Archers: M 115
23 Whitelions: M, SB-Bosorcery 413
5 Dp's: M 160
14 Swordmasters: M, SB -flame 238
5 Reavers 105
2 Eagles 100
So I hope that list supports my thoughts. Next time I get a game with them, this is the list I'll be rocking. If anyone can be bothered commenting on the list, please feel free.
Also got home con coming up in September, so I'll be sharing my thoughts on my Empire list for that (stank stank stank stank...)
Saturday, 23 July 2011
Note to Self- ALWAYS write battle reports...
Just a quick post record a fantastic game today that I a) did not take pics of; and b) did not write notes up on-much to my regret.
It was a Battle of the Pass 2400 High Elves vs OnG. I used the list I used last week. I was up against:
Warboss and BSB in block of Orcs
Savage lvl4: Shrunken head in block of Big Un Savage Orcs
Gobbo lvl2 with scroll
6 trolls
2x5 spider riders
Huge Spider thingie
2x2 gobbo chariots
pump wagon
2 manglers
rock lobba
DDiver
(potential list for a 2400 OnG, skaven, and Dwarf tournament where 1/3 of games will be underground-hence all the strider stuff).
(quick side note-after the game we he realised that had too many points in Rare = pump wagon dropped for 2 spear chukkas in future).
So a lot of history going into this game. The Orc's DDiver has never failed to kill all Dragon Princes on the board and well, big spiders are cool and I promised not to kill it with shooting. Also, it was my opponent's FIRST EVER time using spider riders-despite having 30 painted. (success-they killed an eagle with poison and then died to shooting and solo Dragon Prince charge).
How did the game go?
HOW ABOUT FOOT OF GORK FOR THE WIN. Seriously. Turn 2 the lvl4 IF's it. Direct hit on Whitelions x2 = 4 whitelions left alive, direct hit on Spears, and I get my revenge by standing on the Savage orcs Killing 12. The IF then sucks the lvl4 into the warp and takes the rest of the Savage orcs sans 4 with it.
The shooting phase is another success for the artillery dice.D Diver hits and kills 4 out of 5 Dragon Princes (kills the final 1 2 turns later once remaing prince had soloed a unit of spider riders). And the Rocklobba "hits" and leave only 6 spearelves left in the unit.
In my Next turn I RBT the final SOrcs. Alot of destruction from 1 spell!
The Spider died in spectacular fashion. I saw a overun flank with teh swordmasters via the pumpwagon. So dead pump wagon and Archers into the front of the spider = Swordmasters overrun in the flank of the spider. A Swordmasters were a little disappointing. Only missed 2ce, but only caused 2 wounds (very, very poor rolling!). The archers also sneak a wound past the armour. However, as I had dropped the Spider's strength to 3, it only caused 4 wounds to me. I win through CR and run it down.
That was the only real combat of the game (Trolls finished off the last 4 White Lions who had occupied a building). I shot to death everything else (incl the D Diver). The rocklobba fell apart and I pitted the Trolls. Only things left was the Warboss's unit and the lvl2. My Combat units were waaay to small to engage it, and in the last phase I didn't have enough dice to cast a lucky pit.
So an enjoyable game that I was lucky to win given that Gork had stomped on all my stuff!
It was a Battle of the Pass 2400 High Elves vs OnG. I used the list I used last week. I was up against:
Warboss and BSB in block of Orcs
Savage lvl4: Shrunken head in block of Big Un Savage Orcs
Gobbo lvl2 with scroll
6 trolls
2x5 spider riders
Huge Spider thingie
2x2 gobbo chariots
pump wagon
2 manglers
rock lobba
DDiver
(potential list for a 2400 OnG, skaven, and Dwarf tournament where 1/3 of games will be underground-hence all the strider stuff).
(quick side note-after the game we he realised that had too many points in Rare = pump wagon dropped for 2 spear chukkas in future).
So a lot of history going into this game. The Orc's DDiver has never failed to kill all Dragon Princes on the board and well, big spiders are cool and I promised not to kill it with shooting. Also, it was my opponent's FIRST EVER time using spider riders-despite having 30 painted. (success-they killed an eagle with poison and then died to shooting and solo Dragon Prince charge).
How did the game go?
HOW ABOUT FOOT OF GORK FOR THE WIN. Seriously. Turn 2 the lvl4 IF's it. Direct hit on Whitelions x2 = 4 whitelions left alive, direct hit on Spears, and I get my revenge by standing on the Savage orcs Killing 12. The IF then sucks the lvl4 into the warp and takes the rest of the Savage orcs sans 4 with it.
The shooting phase is another success for the artillery dice.D Diver hits and kills 4 out of 5 Dragon Princes (kills the final 1 2 turns later once remaing prince had soloed a unit of spider riders). And the Rocklobba "hits" and leave only 6 spearelves left in the unit.
In my Next turn I RBT the final SOrcs. Alot of destruction from 1 spell!
The Spider died in spectacular fashion. I saw a overun flank with teh swordmasters via the pumpwagon. So dead pump wagon and Archers into the front of the spider = Swordmasters overrun in the flank of the spider. A Swordmasters were a little disappointing. Only missed 2ce, but only caused 2 wounds (very, very poor rolling!). The archers also sneak a wound past the armour. However, as I had dropped the Spider's strength to 3, it only caused 4 wounds to me. I win through CR and run it down.
That was the only real combat of the game (Trolls finished off the last 4 White Lions who had occupied a building). I shot to death everything else (incl the D Diver). The rocklobba fell apart and I pitted the Trolls. Only things left was the Warboss's unit and the lvl2. My Combat units were waaay to small to engage it, and in the last phase I didn't have enough dice to cast a lucky pit.
So an enjoyable game that I was lucky to win given that Gork had stomped on all my stuff!
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